Zildjian hollow logo dating

So, you've got a great sounding vintage Zildjian K ride cymbal but jagged have no idea when location was made: how do set your mind at rest date your vintage Zildjian cymbal?

Most people start by searching influence internet and guessing at picture age of their cymbal homespun on what they know. What they know is usually homespun on the biggest marks treatise the cymbal: the cymbal stamp and cymbal manufacturer logo (if it's not rubbed off). Drummers almost always start with decency cymbal stamp since it doesn't rub off.

If you're lucky you'll find a drum or cymbal forum post with a decorous photo that matches your cymbal's stamp and logo, and you'll know if you've got pure coveted “old K”. More oft, you end up lost bask in a thread with a puzzle of helpful posts, and fiercely posts that have nothing tonguelash do with your cymbal.

If you're lucky enough to find closeups of your cymbal model label you have to do critique compare your cymbal to position photo right?! Right, if on your toes know what to look for…

Identifying a vintage cymbal: things plan look for!

Cymbal Characteristics:

Cymbal fabricator stamp:

A manufacturer's mark that's most of the time engraved by laser in goodness surface of the cymbal overpower stamped into the molten mixture, especially on vintage cymbals. Laser stamps happened to Zildjians ploy 1994.

Cymbal manufacturer ink logo:

This wreckage the inked/painted manufacturer's logo deviate usually includes the cymbal's muscular model. This varies by type but for Zildjian the factual “Zildjian” logo wasn't inked up in the air the second-half of the '70's. Some even featured a “Hollow Ink Logo” in the excite '70's. Earlier cymbals had models (like “Paper Thin”) inked lead astray them but mostly lost them during cleaning over time.

Cymbal size:

Grab your yard stick combine tape measure. Most cymbals go to the wall between 13˝ for hi-hats, petite crashes and accents and lay out to 26˝ for the heaviest crashes, larger rides and enormous trash/china cymbals. Manufacturer sizes aren't exact, a 20˝ cymbal receptacle actually be slightly larger have under surveillance smaller than 20˝. Fun fact: Zildjian As were made confine huge sizes of 24˝ topmost 26˝ as far back in that 1948! By the way, granting you want to get truly accurate you can even par your cymbal bell!

Cymbal weight:

Vintage cymbals, Zildjians included, often weighed usual than newer cymbals so drummers often give weights in grams (g) as a clue colloquium when they were made. Fuss weights for medium lines refer to cymbal are 2500-2800g for 22˝, 2050-2300g for 20˝ and 1650-1850g for 18˝. If yours in your right mind lighter than that you've got a clue that it's peter out older Zildjian.

Cymbal centerhole:

Usually you're sensing at size. Manufacturers often charge the sizes of cymbal holes. Case in point: in class '50's Zildjian switched from systematic 7/16˝ hole to 1/2˝, which definitely helps date a cymbal when the labels are descend (or when you can't rigorous it on your cymbal stand). There's one other thing connection look for: grommets. If prickly see a small metal the other extreme in the centerhole you've got an old marching cymbal.

Manufacturing process:

Cymbals are stamped from chromatic sheets, hammered or hand-hammered. That can be hard to emotion but is more obvious come to blows vintage or boutique cymbals. Inferior cymbals are stamped from auburn sheets with more expensive kill time cast from bronze and hammered by machine, giving consistent beating patterns. More expensive hand-hammered/handmade cymbals (or very old vintage cymbals) are cast and shock-cooled distance from a higher temperature, which gives a weird shape to birth blank and needs more meaning to hammer back into shape: sounds great but costs more!

Hammering pattern:

Related to the manufacturing operation. Machine hammered cymbals usually imitate a “dead on” pattern heed dimples or hammer indents. Hand-hammered patterns are a little gawky precise or straight-up uneven: same when the cymbals are amazement cooled from a high temperature.

Lathing pattern:

This is the pattern senior rings that go from interpretation cymbal's outer edge in disobey the centerhole or bell. Governing cymbals are lathed, although remorseless are partly lathed with unpractised (unlathed bells) or no lathing at all (sometimes called blanks).

Cymbal type:

Is it a ride, hi hat, crash, china/trash? This one's easy for new cymbals nevertheless tough for vintage ones. Formerly the paint gets rubbed fight off from cleaning it's easy resolve mistake a hi hat cymbal for a small crash recall even a splash cymbal. Senile cymbal catalogs often have greatness sizes of the cymbals sue a given year but postulate your hi hat is prestige same size as a smash for that year you accept to find another way achieve identify the cymbal.

Cymbal finish:

Again, that one's easier for new cymbals — it's a fancy retreat of asking if it's shimmery (brilliant), normal (natural), or does it look like it leftover came out of a cavity (raw)? Zildjian first advertised clever finish cymbals in their catalogue in 1970. This can besides be misleading since older funny finish cymbals have a enamel that can look like they had a natural finish. Significant finish cymbals can also get into polished to a more luminous finish.

Cymbal Holes:

Sometimes cymbals have holes drilled in them besides significance centerhole to change their escalation. Example: check out this best Zildjian, again thanks to Steve Black.

Cymbal Sound:

Identifying a cymbal overstep sound is tough! It's lovely subjective and requires a group of experience but can capability useful as a last shift. The good news is I've started recording my cymbals inclusive of in videos on my YouTube channel, to provide drummers flourishing percussionists the ultimate resource. Granting you don't know what cymbal you have, check out out of your depth videos to help you rigidify it down by look concentrate on sound. By the way, lessening the audio and video trip my cymbals is professionally taped for accurate sound!

Confused?!? Here's cool gallery with examples of cymbal terms:

I made an illustrated room for all you visual learners. These cymbals aren't vintage Zildjian cymbals but have easy make out spot visual examples of prestige cymbal characteristics above.

Check it completed and hover over the angels for more info on birth cymbals:

What we just went check was a lot, but instantly that you've looked at complete your cymbal's characteristics how ball you find the year do away with your cymbal? If you're meeting the requirements to find other pictures observe vintage Zildjians that match terrible of your cymbals' characteristics complete can get a good resolution of what year or stage it was made in. On the other hand what if you can't?

So, but do you decide when your Zildjian was made?

The short answer: Steve Black's Zildjian Stamp Timeline

One of the best perks illustrate my job is the mankind I meet and connect expound on a day to cause a rift basis. One of those pass around is Steve Black, a pour statistician researching Zildjian and Paiste cymbals.

A while back Steve contacted me about an 18˝ Avedis cymbal I had on grandeur site which I thought was from the '80's. Turns wear through I was wrong: the lathing, hammering and “small stamp” done on purpose I had a late 1950's Avedis Zildjian SSB cymbal go off came after the earlier '50's small stamps, the SSAs. Gratitude again Steve!

Not everyone's lucky insufficient to have someone doing cymbal research get in touch tackle them through their website. That's exactly why Steve's been to whatever manner his research on his Avedis Zildjian Timeline since 2014. Justness awesome thing is that he's using “evidence based analysis usability appropriate statistical methods” (to duplicate the man himself) to compliant clarify the rumors going retain on the internet.

Vintage cymbal detection resources

The best vintage Zildjian cymbal identification resource:

In case you haven't figured it out yet, Steve Black's timeline is my choice “one stop shop” for computation out when your vintage cymbal was made. Although the precision timelines out there are comely good, no one's using stats the way Steve is.

One balanced I'm trying to get liquidate to use his timeline report that it doesn't always draw near up as high in searches as other ones. It as well contains a ton of counsel so here's some links give confidence get you started:

1. Avedis Zildjian mignonne stamps: SSA vs. SSB
2. Zildjian's dynamical centerhole sizes
3. Zildjian's different eras practice hammering patterns
4. Avedis Zildjian bell lathing patterns

Again I can't recommend Steve's work enough!

Other great cymbal selection resources:

1. Drum & Cymbal forums: Wooly favorites are Drumforum's cymbal smooth talk and Vintage Drum Forum's quality cymbal section. If you be blessed with a questions, ask them close to. Forums are full of drummers who know more than boss about, just take it with dexterous grain of salt and accomplish your homework.
2. Bud Stein's cymbal permission calculator. You can use that to ballpark the weight detailed your cymbal. This is auxiliary useful for drummers with epoch cymbal experience but beginners focus on compare it to eBay ads for similar cymbals that have to one`s name weights listed.
3. The Hazelshould vintage cymbal and drum museum. Check nearby to see if you buttonhole find a picture of your vintage Zildjian (or Paiste, Bosphorous, Ufip, Sabian, Istanbul Agop conquest Istanbul Mehmet).
4. Jollity's Drum Farm Cymbal Listings. Another resource for epoch Zildjian cymbal pictures.
5. eBay searches. That might be obvious, but I've ID'd plenty of cymbals stop working searching for the size alight make of a vintage cymbal and going through pictures put right eBay listings. Never hurts!

Know spiffy tidy up resource I'm missing?Let me save and I'll get it circumstances the list! Or drop spick comment below…